Thread measurements.

siggypoo · February 23rd, 2015, 15:21

I've a We Scar L GBB with 14mm CW threads on the barrel's muzzle, but I don't know the if they're 1, 1.5, or even 2mm pitch. Doubting 2, but I've no thread gauge yet.
Google has provided naught, maybe my phrasing. Could anyone tell me which drill, tap, and especially die I should look for? If there's nothing metric local to me, I'll order online, but if convenience wins out over waiting, is there an imperial conversion I could pick up that would work?

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

ThunderCactus · February 23rd, 2015, 21:10

M14x1.0 tap or die
Need 13.0mm drill for the tap

there's no imperial equivalent

siggypoo · February 23rd, 2015, 21:50

And what might be the maximum outside diameter of the barrel? I suppose if maybe a bull barrel I have to remove some material. I'm thinking about silencers, flash hiders, and compensators or muzzle brakes.

ThunderCactus · February 24th, 2015, 00:42

Like to pass a die over it? Needs to be 13.8 to 14.0mm

siggypoo · February 24th, 2015, 10:13

Shoot. For one barrel I'm looking at, it's about 13.6mm. That wouldn't be enough, eh?
Is there a topic or table on ASC that I can refer to for common or popular drill/tap/die metrics used in airsoft? I've searched, and haven't found.
As for trimming down barrel wall thicknesses to your suggested 13.8-14.0mm range, I suppose the only way to do that properly is with a lathe.

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

ThunderCactus · February 24th, 2015, 13:34

it would do it, but you'd get a pretty weak thread, maybe only 50% thread form.
There's no tables on ASC since it's pretty common stuff outside of ASC; all metric threads used are standard sizes, you just need to identify the size and pitch
http://mdmetric.com/tech/M-thead%20600.htm

And the ideal way to turn a barrel is on a lathe, or similar (if it's something like a 4" barrel extension you can convert a drill press to a simple vertical lathe)

siggypoo · February 24th, 2015, 15:08

I'll try threading my smaller barrel, and maybe use some plumber's tape to help the grip. If no joy, no huge loss.
I think I better eBay a couple of thread gauges. Thanks a lot for your help.

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

ThunderCactus · February 24th, 2015, 15:41

teflon tape is for sealing, not for building up metal surfaces. It'll take up the tolerance but it won't provide any sort of extra rigidity, you'll still have a wobbly silencer.

What is it exactly are you trying to do?

siggypoo · February 24th, 2015, 18:31

Experiment. I know I can buy a threaded barrel for my KJW 229, but DeeJay is giving me his KJW 226 barrel, and I'd like to learn more by threading it for a suppressor. His barrel has been tried in my gun and it's great.

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

Kos-Mos · February 24th, 2015, 19:14

You should consider threading the INSIDE of the barrel.

Most airsoft pistols use inner threads instead of outer to keep the barrel diameter realistic.
I will get you the exact size tomorrow night when I come back, got a few guns and silencers to check that, plus pitch guage. From the looks of it it's either 1.0 or 0.8mm

siggypoo · February 24th, 2015, 19:42

Thanks much. I have two We's with internal threads. I liked the idea of outside threading. Most suppressors I've come across thread onto the barrel, not into. Including the two I currently own. I spent $10 on a barrel adapter that let me put my rifle suppressor on a pistol, but the threading is full on 'tard.
And again, it's a thought experiment I'd like to try out.
I may very well try your idea of threading inside. If so, the new question is what size tap? I wanna say 10mm. But pos? Neg? 1mm? More? Less?

One more question regarding inside or outside threading. What pitch? While eBaying a thread gauge this eve, I was reminded about thread pitch. What I found was 60 degree. Is that right or airsoft?

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

ThunderCactus · February 24th, 2015, 22:15

http://www.ebay.com/bhp/metric-thread-gauge
Take your pick, you're looking for a "metric thread gage"

Standard airsoft OD barrel thread is M14x1.0 CW or CCW
Don't know about inside, depends on the size of your outer barrel I guess.
Keep in mind structural stress; IE if you have a 15.88mm OD, and thread it M14x1.0 inside, you've only got a 0.94mm thick wall holding the weight of that silencer when you whack it against a wall.

Pitch is the distance from crest to crest, or threads per inch in SAE
Thread angle is the angle on the teeth themselves, standardized in SAE/metric at 60 degrees
Minor diameter is the diameter of the root on an OD thread, or of the crests on an ID thread
Major diameter is the diameter of the crests on an OD thread or of the root on an ID thread
Root and Crest clearance is the distance the root clears the crest (you don't want 0 clearance threads because they'll bind)
Sizing standards are 2B for SAE and 6H for metric. And I haven't done this in a very long time but I believe the standard was 75-80% thread form, which means you're not making pointed teeth but rather with flat on top. This is for better durability and less binding.

siggypoo · February 25th, 2015, 00:32

Now that's the fount of info I wish was in a dedicated topic! Thanks a lot. I'll try 60degree and if it doesn't work out, I still have my stock barrel. I've considered the wall thickness, and I think its durability would be better gauged if I knew what quality metal the KJW barrel was. Sure not 6061, but what? It's mere tint hints to me it's at least a different grade of pot metal, if indeed it is.

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

ThunderCactus · February 25th, 2015, 02:16

Stock barrel, guaranteed pot metal.
The thread form itself will be specified as "ISO metric"; so basically you search any common metric thread stuff and it's going to be the thread form you need.

siggypoo · February 25th, 2015, 10:42

Okay, I got it. I really liked that my KP05 has the externally threaded barrel and accepts the widest variety of attachments. I'm not concerned about realism. If I want a real look without a surpressor, I'll just swap back to the stock barrel.

Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280

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February 23rd, 2015, 15:21	#1
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Thread measurements. I've a We Scar L GBB with 14mm CW threads on the barrel's muzzle, but I don't know the if they're 1, 1.5, or even 2mm pitch. Doubting 2, but I've no thread gauge yet. Google has provided naught, maybe my phrasing. Could anyone tell me which drill, tap, and especially die I should look for? If there's nothing metric local to me, I'll order online, but if convenience wins out over waiting, is there an imperial conversion I could pick up that would work? Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

February 23rd, 2015, 21:50	#3
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Thread measurements. And what might be the maximum outside diameter of the barrel? I suppose if maybe a bull barrel I have to remove some material. I'm thinking about silencers, flash hiders, and compensators or muzzle brakes. __________________ Last edited by siggypoo; February 23rd, 2015 at 22:01..

February 24th, 2015, 10:13	#5
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Shoot. For one barrel I'm looking at, it's about 13.6mm. That wouldn't be enough, eh? Is there a topic or table on ASC that I can refer to for common or popular drill/tap/die metrics used in airsoft? I've searched, and haven't found. As for trimming down barrel wall thicknesses to your suggested 13.8-14.0mm range, I suppose the only way to do that properly is with a lathe. Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

February 23rd, 2015, 21:10	#2
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	M14x1.0 tap or die Need 13.0mm drill for the tap there's no imperial equivalent

February 24th, 2015, 00:42	#4
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	Like to pass a die over it? Needs to be 13.8 to 14.0mm

February 24th, 2015, 13:34	#6
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	it would do it, but you'd get a pretty weak thread, maybe only 50% thread form. There's no tables on ASC since it's pretty common stuff outside of ASC; all metric threads used are standard sizes, you just need to identify the size and pitch http://mdmetric.com/tech/M-thead%20600.htm And the ideal way to turn a barrel is on a lathe, or similar (if it's something like a 4" barrel extension you can convert a drill press to a simple vertical lathe)

February 24th, 2015, 15:08	#7
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	I'll try threading my smaller barrel, and maybe use some plumber's tape to help the grip. If no joy, no huge loss. I think I better eBay a couple of thread gauges. Thanks a lot for your help. Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

February 24th, 2015, 15:41	#8
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	teflon tape is for sealing, not for building up metal surfaces. It'll take up the tolerance but it won't provide any sort of extra rigidity, you'll still have a wobbly silencer. What is it exactly are you trying to do?

February 24th, 2015, 18:31	#9
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Experiment. I know I can buy a threaded barrel for my KJW 229, but DeeJay is giving me his KJW 226 barrel, and I'd like to learn more by threading it for a suppressor. His barrel has been tried in my gun and it's great. Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

February 24th, 2015, 19:42	#11
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Thread measurements. Thanks much. I have two We's with internal threads. I liked the idea of outside threading. Most suppressors I've come across thread onto the barrel, not into. Including the two I currently own. I spent $10 on a barrel adapter that let me put my rifle suppressor on a pistol, but the threading is full on 'tard. And again, it's a thought experiment I'd like to try out. I may very well try your idea of threading inside. If so, the new question is what size tap? I wanna say 10mm. But pos? Neg? 1mm? More? Less? One more question regarding inside or outside threading. What pitch? While eBaying a thread gauge this eve, I was reminded about thread pitch. What I found was 60 degree. Is that right or airsoft? Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

February 24th, 2015, 22:15	#12
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	http://www.ebay.com/bhp/metric-thread-gauge Take your pick, you're looking for a "metric thread gage" Standard airsoft OD barrel thread is M14x1.0 CW or CCW Don't know about inside, depends on the size of your outer barrel I guess. Keep in mind structural stress; IE if you have a 15.88mm OD, and thread it M14x1.0 inside, you've only got a 0.94mm thick wall holding the weight of that silencer when you whack it against a wall. Pitch is the distance from crest to crest, or threads per inch in SAE Thread angle is the angle on the teeth themselves, standardized in SAE/metric at 60 degrees Minor diameter is the diameter of the root on an OD thread, or of the crests on an ID thread Major diameter is the diameter of the crests on an OD thread or of the root on an ID thread Root and Crest clearance is the distance the root clears the crest (you don't want 0 clearance threads because they'll bind) Sizing standards are 2B for SAE and 6H for metric. And I haven't done this in a very long time but I believe the standard was 75-80% thread form, which means you're not making pointed teeth but rather with flat on top. This is for better durability and less binding. Last edited by ThunderCactus; February 24th, 2015 at 22:18..

February 25th, 2015, 00:32	#13
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Now that's the fount of info I wish was in a dedicated topic! Thanks a lot. I'll try 60degree and if it doesn't work out, I still have my stock barrel. I've considered the wall thickness, and I think its durability would be better gauged if I knew what quality metal the KJW barrel was. Sure not 6061, but what? It's mere tint hints to me it's at least a different grade of pot metal, if indeed it is. Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

February 25th, 2015, 02:16	#14
ThunderCactus Not Eye Safe, Pretty Boy Maximus on the field take his picture! Trader rating Join Date: Feb 2007	Stock barrel, guaranteed pot metal. The thread form itself will be specified as "ISO metric"; so basically you search any common metric thread stuff and it's going to be the thread form you need.

February 25th, 2015, 10:42	#15
siggypoo Trader rating Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Oshawa, Ontario.	Thread measurements. Okay, I got it. I really liked that my KP05 has the externally threaded barrel and accepts the widest variety of attachments. I'm not concerned about realism. If I want a real look without a surpressor, I'll just swap back to the stock barrel. Location: YYZ VOR 062 radial, 17.5 DME FL5280 __________________

Thread measurements.

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