New Battery Chemisty

[Corey Darling]

Hi

I've been looking around for cells to build myself a 9.6v Nimh battery for my mp5ras, and decided to check out the R/C heli battery stuff.

Duralite Batteries is now offering a lithium MANGANESE battery with the same high flow output of li-poly, but with a lower risk of explosion if the pack gets damaged.

www.duralitebatteries.com

http://www.duralitebatteries.com/batteries-mg.html

Corey

[LUTNIT]

Originally Posted by Corey Darling

with a lower risk of explosion if the pack gets damaged.

So it lowers it from zero unless your trying to blow it up to what?

Sorry, I'm just tired of hearing people scared of blowing up LiPo batteries when the chances of them exploding in use are the same as NiMh batteries exploding.

These LiMn batteries do seem like they can have some promise but I still don't like something unless its tried and true.

[Kos-Mos]

I don't think it could be good.

Look at the description..

it says that there is an internal protection circuit. If you plan on using this in an upgraded gun, it will block the pack from discharging properly. Yes it is better for the pack, but Li-Po cells can be discharged up to 76A continuous without damage (depends on the type of pack and capacity. Assuming 3800mAH 20C pack).

Did you know that gasoline can explode?
Well it is about the same risk level for Li-Po cells. If you know your pack, there will be no problem.

Plus look at the price! 115$ US plus shipping!

Hell you can get a 4800mAh Li-Po pack in a carbon casing for that price!

[Corey Darling]

Yes, I also disagree with the fear of frequent "pack explosions". I fly model helicopters which use very large Lipo and liion packs and these kinds of failures are very rare. However, when they do happen, they are very dangerous. One guys garage burnt down when his helicopter battery was overcharged one night. If your really paranoid, the best thing to do is keep them in a fire proof container, like a passport lockbox, when not in use or while charging

corey

[Emerald_Justice]

Charging batt without cut-off is always dangerous, just buy a charger with a voltage cutoff. gets rid of those fear. too much is always not good.same to a battery.

[Gryphon]

LiPo fires and explosions should never be underestimated, and certainly don't think their chance of failing in your gun is zero. LiPos are FAR more fragile and can rupture internal membranes from rough handling. It's all well and good to have one sitting in a helicopter that's not supposed to hit anything, versus the contact sport that is airsoft. There's a report on Arnie's from a guy who tried using a LiPo in his MP7 and he somehow managed to damage and bulge it in its first use, and he was being careful. Suffice to say he decided to stick with nickel based chemistries.

Lithium batteries are not yet a mature technology. Just ask Dell.

[HaZarD SFD]

OMG im just going to keep quiet on this subject. I am all for Li-Pos. I will be
buying a 7.4v from Kos-Mos at the beginning of next season. I do think they
dont have a bad blowup factor. When people first get a Heli they do bounce
the shit out of it. An airsoft gun does get banged up if you suck at carrying it
or are just careless. I will secure my battery to my gun with tape and make
sure it doesnt move and isnt attached to the handgrip. But I will also take
care of it when its charging. i.e take it to my friends place and let him
charge lol. J/k lutnit ill probably buy the liposack for safe keeping. If you
can be mindful of your shit then your shit will be mindful to you. Beat it up
and it will fuck you up.

[Hunter Killer]

i didnt know Airsoft gun batterys could explode........

[ancorp]

Well you know now.

Cheers,
Alex

[LUTNIT]

I've had a NiCd blow on me already, it made a pop sound when charging, got really hot, there was a little smoke (not much) and then the pack was dead.

Its true LiPo batteries are far more catastrophic when they blowup but theres been what, two or three reports world wide that are related to airsoft? Compare that to the possible number of nickel based batteries "popping" in the same time period and you find that LiPo's are quite safe. Of course thats assuming you aren't an idiot and you are using a good charger (designed for LiPo's) with a thermal sensor set to the right temperature and a charge balancer as well as charging no higher than 1C.

To give an idea of what a "good" charger is since most airsofters I talk to only know the basics of battery care, the retail price for my power supply and charger (all high end chargers I've found need external DC power supplies) retails for ~$250. Also note that most airsoft specific shops jack the price of chargers and sometimes charge up to 2x what you can get the same charger from an R/C shop for.

[Gryphon]

Originally Posted by LUTNIT

Its true LiPo batteries are far more catastrophic when they blowup but theres been what, two or three reports world wide that are related to airsoft?

Could that possibly be because LiPos currently represent say 0.0003% of batteries used in guns worldwide?

[HaZarD SFD]

Originally Posted by Gryphon

Could that possibly be because LiPos currently represent say 0.0003% of batteries used in guns worldwide?

Umm you forgot about RC Cars that are driven like hell. Planes and helicopters
that crash.

[Corey Darling]

"Umm you forgot about RC Cars that are driven like hell. Planes and helicopters
that crash." Hazard

Thats right, the guys i fly with are extremely knowlegable about these cells and fly alot of electric fixed wing stuff. They are constantly crashing the shit out of these planes because they make them out of cheap foam and then hot glue them back together lol, they are fun to run into each other with after a heli meet. the batteries are alot tougher than people think.

Note: the lithium batteries are completely exposed on the sides of these foam planes. just held on with velro

I originally posted this new battery info after seeing alot of people on this forum worried about these things blowing up. Like many other people have said in this post, if handled correctly with a high quality charger (R/C chargers are great, lots out there) then the risk is far lower than the potential benifit, just my 2 cents.

And in the R/C helicopters, the cells go through manuvers of +/- 6 to 10 g. Just wrap the cells in foam to protect them from stray bbs and bumps. I know that the MP5 RAS has an exposed battery tray in the rails.

corey

[HaZarD SFD]

I am talking about inexperienced people Cory. falls in the same category as
inexperienced people with batterys for anything. Fuckups happen. Yes no
probs with all the experts because they were smart enough to do their
homework and have been flying for a long time.

[Corey Darling]

If you guys want lots of info, check out www.runryder.com and search for Lithium batteries

this is a r/c helicopter forum, the people there use these things everyday.

corey